Every year I receive questions about things I have written or said that are not really questions about Middle-earth but which are sort of questions about Middle-earth. Sometimes I can justify writing an entire article around a question like that, such as “Why Does Parma Endorion Use the Wrong Translation for ‘Eriador’?” (Short answer: I didn’t mean for “the land between the mountains” to stand as a translation of “Eriador”, which means “lone lands”). Here are a few more questions it has been hard for me to fit into the article schedule. Some of them are just straight questions about Middle-earth for which the answers are too short to justify their own articles.
Q: Where did you get “billions” of years from?
Here is the question I received in August 2017:
In your article “Why did the Valar ‘abandon’ the Elves and Men in ME in the First Age?” from April 16, 2014 you have this paragraph:
“By the end of his life Tolkien was reimagining Middle-earth as the product of not thousands of years of history but of millions, billions of years of history. He would have had to radically change all the old stories and myths (such as the tale of the Two Trees) in order to create a more scientific backstory for Middle-earth. He never really got far with that project but he recorded some of his thoughts and ideas.”
I was wondering where you are getting those numbers from. I did the math, and even with setting a Valian year to 144 years, you still only get about 700,000 years according to the dates in Annals of Aman. I understand that the 500,000 years before the trees may have been underestimated (it’s said to have only been a calculation of later loremasters), and that there also is the “Ages of labour beyond knowledge or reckoning in the great halls of Ea” to account for, and so I can see how one would approximate the history of Arda as millions of years. But I still don’t see how you got at “billions of years of history”.
Any sources you can point to?
The source is “Myths Transformed” in Morgoth’s Ring, where Christopher Tolkien explained (briefly) that toward the end of his life J.R.R. Tolkien began to regret the mythological framework for Middle-earth. The “legendarium”, as I have attempted to explain through the years, was more in Tolkien’s mind than in his fiction. His conception of what should be the “legendarium” evolved over the decades. The various mythologies and “phases” of the mythologies (as Christopher Tolkien once described them) represented an ever-growing body of legends and stories that were supposed to be part of a fictitious history.
Eventually Tolkien felt that history would work better if it were rewritten to be more “scientific”. Hence, the “billions of years” is a reference to the age of the universe. Assuming Tolkien would keep the stories about the Valar in his revised mythology, they would enter Eä at the beginning of Time and Space (the beginning of the universe, which our science currently estimates to have occurred about 13.8 billion years ago). How Tolkien would have worked the Two Trees and the history of the Elves into that framework will forever be a mystery to us. I doubt he had any clear idea even in the last year of his life about how he would have done it.
Q: Do we know the provenance of Narsil before Elendil took ownership of it?
The question I received in July 2017 reads thus:
We know that it was made by Telchar, a dwarf of Nogrod. Curufin was one of the very few Elves to have successfully learned Khuzdul in the First Age (iirc), and he owned another of Telchar’s works: Angrist. It seems reasonable that Narsil, much like the Dragon Helm of Dor-lomin, made its way to the Elves, and from them into the hands of Men. I haven’t been able to find any hard evidence, though.
In “A Description of Numenor” in “Unfinished Tales,” it’s noted that “the King and most of the great chieftains possessed swords as heirlooms of their fathers.” Note 2 of that section goes on to say that Aranruth, the sword of Elu Thingol, was the King’s sword, and lists other relics such as the Axe of Tuor, the Bow of Bregor, etc, as being royal heirlooms. It seemed to me that Narsil, being of such great and high lineage, deserved a place among the heirlooms of the royal house, and may have been passed on to the Lords of Andunie along with the Ring of Barahir, but no such reference is made.
Elendil’s ownership of Narsil leaves me with the impression that it was the heirloom sword of the heirs of Valandil, but again, it all seems like speculation.
To answer the question in the title: No, we don’t know the provenance of Narsil. I would guess, if forced to, that it was probably wielded by someone close to Elros and probably descended through a marriage between that lineage and Elros’ descenedants in Andúnië. However, it could also have been one of the gifts of the Eldar to the Númenóreans at any time during the Second Age, especially when the Eldar of Tol Eressëa were still on close, friendly terms with the people of Númenór.
Q: What kind of squirrels did they have in Middle Earth?
I received the following question in August 2017:
In the Two Towers, Frodo and Sam are taken by Faramir and his men to Henneth Annûn.
Later, Gollum/Smeagol is spotted fishing in the forbidden pool. His men report to Faramir that at first they thought it was some sort of black squirrel. IIRC, this description was applied to him another time or two.
What kind of squirrels did they have in Middle Earth? That seems rather odd.
Well, they had the same kind of squirrels we have on Earth today. In fact, black squirrels are real creatures. Wikipedia says “The black squirrel occurs as a melanistic subgroup of both the eastern gray squirrel and the fox squirrel. Their habitat extends throughout the Midwestern United States, in some areas of the Northeastern United States, eastern Canada, and also in the United Kingdom. The overall population of black squirrels is small when compared to that of the gray squirrel…” I don’t know how reliable that information is. I did find pictures of black squirrels to use for the speculative article “Horror in the Woods: How Men Live in Mirkwood”. The pictures of white deer are also legitimate. I tinctured the pictures with sepia tones to give them an archaic look.
Q: Why didn’t Saruman take Narya from Gandalf when he held him prisoner in Orthanc?
The full question (which I received in August 2017) adds: “He knew that Gandalf had the ring, didn’t he?” Well, Tolkien wrote that Saruman found out or suspected Cirdan gave Narya to Gandalf. But, seriously, how could he have forced Gandalf to give up the ring?
Gandalf allowed himself to be taken prisoner. He possessed the power to free himself but he chose not to. I presume he felt he would have to violate the Valar’s command not to show himself in a display of power were he to openly resist Saruman. And he had no way of knowing how far gone Saruman was. Gandalf always seemed open to putting his faith in providence (which is the mark of a loyal servant of Ilúvatar, in my humble opinion). But the only definitive answer I can provide is “I/we don’t know why Saruman didn’t take the ring.”
Q: How did Gollum sneak out of Moria without being seen from the Fellowship?
This is a great question (submitted in September 2017) and one for which I don’t have a definitive (by the book, from any textual source) answer. Tolkien never explained how Gollum got out, so far as I know.
My guess is that Gollum was probably known to and tolerated by the Orcs of Moria. He could simply have followed them out after they devised their own means of crossing or going around the chasm (where Gandalf broke the bridge).
Q: What is the desert of Lostladen and where can it be found (map location and borders) approximately?
I received this question in January 2018 (i was sick with the flu at the time and received/ignored quite a few messages that month). Tolkien Gateway places Lostladen just south of Mordor. I don’t have access to any more information than is noted there. Sorry.
Bonus question: “Can we assume any reason, behind it being cut from the published map of the Lord of the Rings?” I would guess that Tolkien thought of the name on the fly, liked it, and placed it on the map with the intention of using it somewhere in the narrative or backstories but eventually never found a reason to do so.
Q: Were the Nazgûl present at the Battle of Dagorlad?
I received a question about this in February 2018. Technically, people ask about this quite often. And there is no text-based definitive answer to the question. I think it’s reasonable to assume that Tolkien imagined the Nazgûl commanding Sauron’s armies at the end of the Second Age. However, after those armies had been destroyed they would have been less effective against Gil-galad and the Lords of the Eldar. If you’re writing fan fiction or role-playing game adventures whatever you can imagine them doing in the final years of the siege of Barad-dur is probably reasonable.
NOTE: See fantasywind’s comment below.
Q: All the exiled Elves, including Finrod Felagund, live in Tol Eressëa?
I received this question in February 2018. So far as I know, that is where the returned Noldor-in-Exile would live. Tolkien never explained where the Sindar or Silvan Elves would go. Nor does he really explain where the resurrected Elves would live.
I think it’s reasonable to assume that as the Elves’ numbers increased the Valar might make other arrangements for them. Also, it’s reasonable to ask or guess that Tol Eressëa and Aman were only part of a new world, or perhaps changed and increased in some way when they were separated from Middle-earth.
Q: Where should I start learning about Middle-earth through linguistic essays?
This question came at the end of a long comment I received in February 2018, and which I am keeping in reserve with a few other older comments/questions for possible future articles. However, the linguistic texts are not easy to find. You can begin learning about them at Tolkien Gateway. The official releases for these materials come through either Vinyar Tengwar or Parma Eldalamberon by special arrangement with the Tolkien Estate. If you subscribe to these newsletters you’ll receive future issues and have limited opportunities to purchase some (recent) back issues. However, I don’t know where you’ll be able to get their entire backlogs.
Some people do upload pirate copies of these publications to the Web. Some academic papers and books quote from them. I’ve allowed my own subsciptions to such journals to lapse across the years and I don’t have access to all the linguistic material. A lot of it consists of discussions of specific words, phrases, or translations J.R.R. Tolkien made of things like prayers or poems into Elvish. There are a number of word lists that have been uploaded to Websites, but the task of extracting (fictional) historical anecdotes from that material is quite tedious. I tend to limit my research into the linguistic sources to the questions I receive.
There are also a few linguistic discussion groups but I would not consider them useful sources of information about the fictional histories of Middle-earth. The discussions assume at least a basic knowledge of linguistic vocabulary (if you don’t know what “lenition” means you’ll get lost very quickly).
Q: Why Did Tolkien say the Easterlings and Orcs were “ten times” the match of Aragorn’s Army of the West?
This question was submitted in February 2018. I believe the reference is only to the numbers of the forces. Aragorn’s army was just a token force intended to draw Sauron’s attention away from Frodo’s journey into Mordor. He and his allies knew they were vastly outnumbered and had no intention of trying to obtain a military victory. So they took an army strong enough to be a problem but not so strong that it emptied Gondor and Rohan of all their forces.
The comparative difference between Aragorn’s army and Sauron’s forces was not one of skill or morale, but merely of numbers. Although Aragorn’s army was able to defeat those vastly superior numbers after Sauron was defeated (with the destruction of the One Ring) and his will no longer controlled his followers.
Q: I’ve submitted several questions to you and never hear from you. Why?
A very small number of people have complained about never hearing back from me. The most common reason I have been able to determine (besides the fact it can take me a year or longer to get to these messages) is that we manage our own email service. Getting past all the spam filters is no easy thing. Some Internet service providers set up what seem like ridiculously stupid filtering rules for their customers. They have their reasons for doing that.
Sometimes my replies are sent to spam folders and people write back to me months after I’ve written to them.
And sometimes our own filters prevent us from replying. I received several emails from a group in China who wanted to translate the Middle-earth blog for their non-profit Website. I tried to give them my permission and blessing every time but the emails bounced. We apply aggressive filtering to Chinese IP addresses, and I can only assume that is why we were unable to communicate.
I do apologize for the apparent lack of responses.
See also …
- Answers for Short Questions from Tolkien Fans (September 2018)
- Short Questions and Answers (March 2018)
- More Questions with Short Answers (July 2017)
- Answers Too Short for Their Own Articles (May 2017)
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Have you read our other Tolkien and Middle-earth Questions and Answers articles?
Many interesting questions I must say that it is fascinating to know that Tolkien came up with name for a desert south of Mordor, Desert of Lostladen (it’s another interesting references to place names in the south besides the Nargil pass the southern passage into Mordor through southern range of Ephel Duath), though it’s a vague reference in HoME :). It’s also interesting that Lostladen is also referred as Lothlann which is the old place name in Beleriand for “wide and empty” plain that was east of Ard-galen, though it’s seems to be the case that various place names are reused hehe, after all somewhere in Gondor there is vale of Tumladen :), the same name was given to the green valley within Encircling Mountains where Gondolin stood. Speaking of deserts I wonder whether the Last Desert mentioned in the Hobbit could possibly ‘exist’ if it wasn’t merely Hobbit folklore, hehe “to the East of East and fight the wild Were-worms in the Last Desert”, this would be nice equivalent to Gobi and the were-worms (if they are ‘real’ within Middle-earth) would be…mongolian death worm? 🙂
As for the Nazgul in the War of the Last Alliance, the Unfinished Tales seem to confirm their presence, though all we know is that after defeat of Sauron and siege of Barad-dur his forces dispersed and many of his servants including the Nazgul fled east.
“The servants of Sauron were routed and dispersed….
The Silmarillion, Of the Rings of Power and the Third Age
“….his forces had been destroyed. If any few had escaped, they had fled far to the East with the Ringwraiths.”
Unfinished Tales, Part 3, Ch 1, The Disaster of the Gladden Fields: Notes, Note 20
Nor does he really explain where the resurrected Elves would live.
No, he doesn’t. But Finrod Felagund was an exception.
“Finrod walks with Finarfin his father beneath the trees in Eldamar.” (Silmarillion 207)
It’s possible that Finrod (being a very nice lad) was released from Mandos before the end of the First Age, while Tol Eressëa was still uninhabited. There wouldn’t have been much reason or justification for confining him there.